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When I read your meta-fantasy, my first thought wasn't "her conscious is holding her back." Instead it was "her (non-meta) fantasies have become as romanticized as an actual rape used to be."

What I mean is, the thought of performing the role-play is as sexually exciting (maybe more-so?) to you as the thought of having that romanticized rape experience "for real."

(Admittedly, I'm going under the assumption that fantasies are expressions of desire, not desire that might get mucked up by other states of mind.)

Of course, you know yourself better than a reader on the internet, but if I were you I'd consider myself lucky, not annoyingly moral. In effect, those times that you do get to physically act out your fantasy, it is "the real thing," and not just an imitation.

Julie paradox

I think I might have sort of done something similar once or twice.

There was one (I was much younger, she adds hastily and not-quite-mendaciously) which involved an enchantment you could take which would take over and thus appear to make your fantasy real, while also shielding you from interruptions or discovery from family members (I also generally need quite a lot of backstory).

That one involved sexual violence, which I wasn't particularly comfortable fantasising at the time.

Although as it never actually worked - I tried several times before realising that I was always going to get bored half-way through - I'm not sure it counts ;-)

Ubquitous Che

... That's actually really fascinating to think about.

Q: Does this happen to anyone else?

Not as overtly as you've described here. I haven't really thought about things in terms of a meta-fantasy before. Now that you've given me the idea, I'm probably gonna start noticing them everywhere. ^_^

In my case, methinks I'm a bit more vanilla when it comes to sex than yourself. But I do occasionally have the odd fantasy of doing horrible things to a girl - usually a girl that I'm attracted to in spite of disliking her.

But in the fantasy, even if the girl finds the act somewhat uncomfortable, I never actually fantasize about a situation where she actually objects.

So maybe that's something of a boundary condition - not quite a meta-fantasy, exactly. But it feels like a similar vein of thought.

Q: And if so, what's your take on it?

I don't think it has as much to do with conscience as you were musing it to be.

I think it comes down to what we really want.

If you wanted a fantasy where you were doing dark and horrible things to a person, my guess is that you'd just have one. However, it may just so happen that that's not a fantasy that you actually want to have right at this moment.

And if that's just not what you want, then that's just not what you want. I don't see the need to go any deeper. Most of the time, our wants are the way they are because that's just how they are.

Simply put, I think that having an actual rape fantasy where I'm the perpetrator wouldn't make me feel good. So I don't want it. So I don't do it.

In your case, a fantasy about performing a rape fantasy with a consenting partner where you're performing the role of the perpetrator clearly feels good to you - and I'd agree. So we want it. So we do it.

I just don't see what role 'conscience' has to play in it. Ultimately, we do what we want. Some of our wants are noble. Some of them are dark. How it all falls over into the actions we take is a waaaay more complex than whitewashing it all with a label like 'conscience' presents it to be.

Paul Crowley

Yes, I do this all the time - my fantasies sometimes include segments where the protagonist approaches occasional playmates at a fetish club to discuss setting the scene up, or even the bit where people are drinking cups of tea waiting for everyone to turn up, and talking about what they're about to do.

I think there's no more to it than that once you've had a lot of SM sex, it provides a familiar backdrop against which suspension of disbelief is a breeze.


That's very interesting. It never happened to me that I can remember. My intellect tells me the same thing about sexual fantasies that you wrote here:

"It's not that I think there's anything wrong with having coercion/ force/ rape fantasies without the "meta-fantasy" distancing technique. I don't, at all. I feel very strongly that no fantasy in this world -- not a fantasy about being Hitler molesting a kitten, nothing -- is unethical. Fantasies are, by definition, consensual. No fantasy is bad."

And my libido seems to agree with this too.

Kade Azkyroth
And so I ask again:

Does this happen to anyone else?

And if so, what's your take on it?

Yes, actually. At length. I think it has more to do with my meticulous approach to backstory and plausibility than with specific feelings of conscience. I don't think it's something to worry about, though it's fun to analyze these things.

Kade Azkyroth

As a second thought, I suspect part of it has to do with the astonishingly large number of people who need it explained to them repeatedly that having a fantasy (or being turned on by reading about one) doesn't equate to a desire to actually live it (IE, not just roleplay it, but act on it).


I think one of the key differences is that the Atheist movement is all about getting rid of superstition and irrational thought. Atheism is all about approaching the world around us rationally. If you can't actually see/hear/touch/taste/smell it - it doesn't exist. No mumbo-jumbo about a magic man in the sky.

And a lot of hatred and prejudice is just plain superstitious. There's no rational reason for homophobia.

When your community is all about getting rid of superstition, you wind up throwing away a lot of hatred too.

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